DVD or DOWNLOAD?
For the last two weeks there has been the rumble of construction as AT&T put a new fiber box in the area, allowing us to possibly tap into some of that immense bandwidth and internet power of Warner Bros. The result is, as they seem to be offering, faster-than-cable internet service, digital and HD TV, phone service, and maybe even iphone service all in one package, available to all. This not only breaks the monopoly the cable company had in the area up 'til now, but gives everyone some incredible internet abilities.
With Apple TV sales allegedly "...through the roof, far beyond what Apple had planned.", according to applerecon.com, and massive lines at stores to get the iphone, both of which play widescreen video, including those from Youtube, people are getting attached to instant, or at least close to it, satisfaction of video downloads. Just two short years ago opponents of video downloads said it would never happen, with downloads taking too long, the lack of broadband penetration and an expected lack of ease. However, just like many music services proved in the years before, creating a multi-billion dollar "pay-per-download" music industry, which trounced all subscribtion and advertising based methods, now new services are repeating the same success with video.
iTunes boasts many full TV shows and a few movies in their online catalog. Already companies like Funimation and Mediaworks are releasing anime like Basilisk and Gunslinger Girl to iTunes. Now, of course, these major media outlets are only catering to the major studios, making rules about the size of content libraries to effectively keep indies from entering, but the technology itself has the potential to level the playing field.
Think about it. These services make their play based entirely on volume, and as such they serve mass market content. The niche market content is just not there. But they have proven the model. They have shown people will go for it. The key is to realize that if people can find it, they will also go to wherever is necessary to get the niche market content they desire to see, especially if this content can still be made to easily work with the tools and gadgets they already have.
If you can make your content work on the iPhone, easy to get on Apple TV, or work on the iPod, PSP or other popular device, and if you can bring the people to it, then why not simply sell it yourself, leaving behind these services that will take more than 50% of your profit for something pretty much anyone can do on the net. Now some will say, "Yeah but, being on iTunes or some big service has advantages. They have a name." The truth is, it doesn't matter where you are on the internet if no one knows you are there. There are thousands of items on iTunes, Custom Flix, Amazon, Lulu and everywhere else that no one knows or cares about. Your job then is to bring people to your content and if that is the case, why not bring them toyour site and let them download it directly for a very low price?
As a viewer today, which do you prefer? Do you like the DVD, going to stores and buying, ordering and waiting for it to be shipped? Or do you use iTunes, tools like bittorrent and download video content to view when you want? What about "On Demand" cable viewing of movies, Pay Per View, and similar services? On the flip side, as a creator, which would you prefer to sell? Digital downloads have absolutely no overhead, no manufacturing cost, nothing to ship. Or you can make a DVD, which can be manufactured through a replication house, forcing you to order in bulk and then deal with shipping yourself, or you can use a service like Custom Flix and Amazon, which take a large chuck of the profits for their trouble.
Personally, I like my DVD library. I like being able to play a DVD apart from my computer too, for example, while I am working. But lately, I am at the point where, when I think of something I want to see, I want to click a button and download it, and see it. These days, when I find out about a book, I hope it's available as an ebook. When I find a song I like, I hope it's on iTunes, MySpace or the MP3 is easy to come by. And with high speed internet, I more and more want to be able to just download a movie and view it too.
With Apple TV sales allegedly "...through the roof, far beyond what Apple had planned.", according to applerecon.com, and massive lines at stores to get the iphone, both of which play widescreen video, including those from Youtube, people are getting attached to instant, or at least close to it, satisfaction of video downloads. Just two short years ago opponents of video downloads said it would never happen, with downloads taking too long, the lack of broadband penetration and an expected lack of ease. However, just like many music services proved in the years before, creating a multi-billion dollar "pay-per-download" music industry, which trounced all subscribtion and advertising based methods, now new services are repeating the same success with video.
iTunes boasts many full TV shows and a few movies in their online catalog. Already companies like Funimation and Mediaworks are releasing anime like Basilisk and Gunslinger Girl to iTunes. Now, of course, these major media outlets are only catering to the major studios, making rules about the size of content libraries to effectively keep indies from entering, but the technology itself has the potential to level the playing field.
Think about it. These services make their play based entirely on volume, and as such they serve mass market content. The niche market content is just not there. But they have proven the model. They have shown people will go for it. The key is to realize that if people can find it, they will also go to wherever is necessary to get the niche market content they desire to see, especially if this content can still be made to easily work with the tools and gadgets they already have.
If you can make your content work on the iPhone, easy to get on Apple TV, or work on the iPod, PSP or other popular device, and if you can bring the people to it, then why not simply sell it yourself, leaving behind these services that will take more than 50% of your profit for something pretty much anyone can do on the net. Now some will say, "Yeah but, being on iTunes or some big service has advantages. They have a name." The truth is, it doesn't matter where you are on the internet if no one knows you are there. There are thousands of items on iTunes, Custom Flix, Amazon, Lulu and everywhere else that no one knows or cares about. Your job then is to bring people to your content and if that is the case, why not bring them toyour site and let them download it directly for a very low price?
As a viewer today, which do you prefer? Do you like the DVD, going to stores and buying, ordering and waiting for it to be shipped? Or do you use iTunes, tools like bittorrent and download video content to view when you want? What about "On Demand" cable viewing of movies, Pay Per View, and similar services? On the flip side, as a creator, which would you prefer to sell? Digital downloads have absolutely no overhead, no manufacturing cost, nothing to ship. Or you can make a DVD, which can be manufactured through a replication house, forcing you to order in bulk and then deal with shipping yourself, or you can use a service like Custom Flix and Amazon, which take a large chuck of the profits for their trouble.
Personally, I like my DVD library. I like being able to play a DVD apart from my computer too, for example, while I am working. But lately, I am at the point where, when I think of something I want to see, I want to click a button and download it, and see it. These days, when I find out about a book, I hope it's available as an ebook. When I find a song I like, I hope it's on iTunes, MySpace or the MP3 is easy to come by. And with high speed internet, I more and more want to be able to just download a movie and view it too.
28 Comments:
I, too, wrestled with this subject about whether to offer download or DVD. I finally decided to offer both. And, it's not much problem to change format to offer an Ipod or PSP version, as well. I use Lulu, so, it's not much more to upload the download version and then upload the DVD iso file. Since, Lulu handles the burning and shipping; I don't have the worry of having a 'warehouse' to do those things.
The biggest thing at the moment for me is driving traffic to either my site or my Lulu storefront and then having people order the download or DVD. It's a challenge, I feel, for the indie to be as big a marketing force as the big companies; because, 1) how do you break into the large markets and 2) how do you spend half of your time just marketing. But, I feel, over time, if the indie continues offering product in a timely fashion; then, it will take time to foster your own niche following and grow from there. It's a challenge to wear all the hats on the production side and marketing side.
Anyone know good places to advertise or what sites are good places to post about your work to drive traffic?
To me that's the biggest challenge to breaking in.
Terrence,
How would you advertise your downloadable movie? Buy adspace on
a popular news site or something?
Even a trailer on youtube might get
get lost in the shuffle.
tyler: In the book Cluetrain Manifesto, which I highly recommend, there is a lot of great info on Web 2.0 marketing. I would not buy a single ad or spend one peny on advertising. It doesn't work. On the internet it is all about brand identity.
I would certainly have a permanent banner on my site. I would put in my signature on all mails and in all my forum posts, but I would never want to start thinking old school in advertising. And you are right about Youtube. Ever see Afterworld? That was a major production from Budweiser, a huge company, and, when I checked it, the first five episodes only had 1000 or so views, but episode 6, which got a front page special placement on Youtube, got 100,000 views and then it took off. Even they got lost for a while.
I think Ernest has the right idea. Over time you have to build up brand identity by continually releasing content in a timely fashion. Your audience will grow with you. Homestar Runner, Red vs. Blue, Rocket Boom, PVP, all grew amazing sized audiences over a period of months or even a year or more. Even Anigen was getting over 20,000 views per month when it was running. And that is very niche market content.
Ernest: My question to you would be, why would you want to "break into the large markets?" or "be as big a marketing force as the big companies?" You're not making the same content as them. What we do is not going to have the viewership of CSI or Crossing Jordan or even Smallville. But at the same time, the people who have seen enough of the mainstream stuff and want something different are looking for us.
Remember, the big companies also need to spend half their time marketing because they need millions and millions of viewers in order to make a profit on their overly expensive productions. Building a niche market that is loyal to your brand is the way to go for the indie.
Advertising and posting about your work is the worst thing to do in the Web 2.0 world. Stick a link to your work in your signature in email and forums and just go in and be a part of the conversation. Answer questions, help people and just participate, but never mention your show because that can create an immediate backlash. Word of mouth is still the indie's best weapon.
I know that M Dot Strange (after running into some issues with several film distributors, I believe) decided to take control of his film's distribution on his own and plans on releasing "We Are The Strange" for YouTube, DVD, and digital download sometime this August.
(maybe you could ask him to discuss some of things he encountered in his film's promotion and distribution?)
"Advertising and posting about your work is the worst thing to do in the Web 2.0 world. Stick a link to your work in your signature in email and forums and just go in and be a part of the conversation. Answer questions, help people and just participate, but never mention your show because that can create an immediate backlash. Word of mouth is still the indie's best weapon. "
Also, from a Copywrite/Intellectual Property perspective, that's the smartest thing you can do to protect yourself and your work:
even mention infomation about your project's plot/characters/etc on the web, before your project is 95-100% completed, and you can officially kiss your IP goodbye.
Age plays apart in this. I & my friends talked about the possibilities of the Iphone which launched last Friday what surprised me was we were split by age.
Those of us who are under 35 who constantly use their iPod’s, PSP’s, and or Blueberry’s opt for what technology holds, downloading music and other content is the norm. Stores like Virgin Records are just a hang out spot a place to sample what’s out there where those of us over 35 prefer buying content from Virgin Records and stores alike and having a tangible product in hand even software, also the idea of looking at content on one of these devices is something most of us dislike, which is strange because I’m constantly saying how the comic book industry suffers from not embracing the internet and technology such as iPod’s, PSP’s and other hand held devices. The under 35 and the now generation is very excepting of viewing content on these devices but very few of the over 35 are.
As a consumer I see downloading as a plus as long as I’m able to take said download and burn it to disc or safe house it for future use. I have downloaded music, movies, and other media using bittorrent but bittorrent is free and in most cases is missing the extra content which for me is a must. I’m not closed to new technology and digital downloading but cost is a major factor, I’m a cable subscriber but I hate Pay per view for that reason I’m already paying for cable why pay for a movie which will be on any of the 30 movie channels I have in the next 2 weeks?
Like you Terrence I like my DVD library but know it’s only a matter of time in which I’ll have to choose between buying a Blu-ray or HD DVD unit and then it will be some other new format coming out hopefully one which will still play my vast DVD collection. Again as a teach head downloading media on my computer isn’t a problem as my computer is so integrated with my home theater system it’s basically one this is something else which needs to change with the consumer as well.
For the indie creator this is all good as it opens many doors. Over head is cut a direct to a global market can be achieved, and if one is able to achieve such they won’t have to find that balance between Digital downloads or manufacturing units. Bandwidth is the key the once huge division between TV and the internet is closing, compression rates are improving and so far the monopoly houses are not totally monopolizing at least not in a way which is totally cutting off access to the indies.
D Knighton: I decided that I'm just going to wait out the "HD format war" and see which one ends up being the "winner" - at this point, I believe it's still far too early to figure out which format is going to be supreme... plus, it doesn't help that the 'Studios' are forcing consumers to have to chose between one format over the other if they want that Studio's films in HD. :/
I say do both. You can do a short run DVD and hit all the comicon's and animecons in the area to let your product be known to those interested in like type movies, assuming you all are making a movie that fits in that genre of work!
Sell a special DVD at those locations and then of course do your online sales as well. Getting everywhere you can.
Comicon's/conventions are a great way to get known. Get an artist alley booth at a big one and then hit up a few smaller ones in your area. Promote your DVD to these special groups and target your special groups. Let them put a face with a name and a product and a story all at one pop.
Hit the internet hard with teaser's, trailers, and the like again showing off your product. Youtube, Newgrounds, Metacafe it etc. Have a downloadable version ready to go as a pay per view.
Personally I'd find sponsorship and support from small vendors as well. Find a webbased company and ask if they want to pay for an add or you can trade a service for theirs. For example you are making a cool looking movie with a designer toy type look and very nice market, hip and funky looking. Why not ask Kid Robot.com if you can place a free add in all your downloadable movies for free if they put you on the front page of their sight? Make deals with folks and be selective. Barter system. On my film I'm hoping and looking to get involved with the guys from a certain high profile online series. One of my characters in the movie is dressed like one of their characters in a costume and one is wearing a shirt as a homage to their character. In turn I'm hoping they will showcase me on their sight while I promote buying their tshirts. I'm also contacting a small candy company to get sponsorship as I present their candy in my movie. Characters are selling their candy.
Get involved with the internet community. Let them know you are out there. M Dot Strange has a great deal doing a blog online almost every other day or once a week. He gets to know his viewers. Not only help support them look to get the support you need out there. There are the more popular kids in the box who are willing to support you.
There are large communities and special interest sights to get seen at including for example for animation AWN.com, Animwatch.com, ETC. Post your progress at CGtalk.com and any special interest website.
Submit your stuff to magazines such as 3d world and things like that showing your progress. They may showcase you. You'd be suprised how you could get in one of those magazines. For example a post me and some guys started about the unfairness of Maya's liscensing for motionbuilder got a lot of steam on CGtalk and then I open up 3d world magazine and low and behold I'm staring right at our post and concern from the forums.
Hit up your film at film festivals.
Big and small!
So far we have comic book, anime and various conventions in your area. Plus make sure to get in an artist alley at a big one like San Diego international comicon! It works for the big dogs to go to those things and show off and why not you.
One thing I might suggest is get a name talent involved if possible. For example some of the artists I've been trying to get to work on my film have said they would but had to bow out. The thing is if you ask you can receive. You'd be suprised who I have approached and got accepted by. However things like Batman, Spiderman, and Hell Boy made them jump off my humble project. :) It's an honor though to get dissed for Spiderman, Batman and Hellboy. But if I secure a great artist then alot of times they have a large fan base. Just a thought.
At the end of the day the best thing to do is A) make a quality product worth seeing
Even if you suck at drawing and such be good at something. M Dot Strange is not the best drawer there is by far, but he worked hard and made it work for him. He did not let a lack of a certain skill set get him down, he worked and created his own style and it works.
Simply make a good product.
B) Get seen by people by being around people. Go where they go and meet them. Get your face and product out to as many people as possible and be very targetted to whom you want to attract.
PS Hey just wanted to fill in this little group with some news. I am a semi finalist in the Platinum challenge at comicon hosted by AT&T!! Apparently they kind of liked my story idea and are flying me down to Comicon in San Diego to pitch my story in front of great artists and producers. :)
OK, I put that book you recommended in my amazon cart. Then I put in: "internet marketing" and came up with these:
How to Use the Internet to Advertise, Promote and Market Your Business or Website with Little
or No Money
Street Smart Internet Marketing - Tips, Tools, Tactics & Techniques to Market Your Product, Service, Business or Ideas Online
Search Engine Marketing, Inc.: Driving Search Traffic to Your Company's Web Site (Ibm Press)
Pay-Per-Click Search Engine Marketing Handbook: Low Cost Strategies for Attracting New Customers Using Google, MSN, Yahoo & Other Search Engines
The first two are basically for beginners. I stayed away from anything that hinted of: "make millions on the internet instantly!" These seem to get pretty good reviews. So I have my reading cut out for me.
It should be interesting to see how
"we are the strange" does, but then
it looks to me like it will become a cult movie. I'm not looking to do anything quite that weird.:)
tyler: I'm sorry to say this and please don't take this as being rude, but a few of the options you mention I find to be seriously flawed.
Maybe I just don't know the "Game" of it all or perhaps I'm just an arrogant fool, I don't know - this is just my view on independent filmmaking: when you go out of your way to change elements of your project (however small or large they may be) to gain finiance/sponsorship from other individuals, you are giving up control of YOUR film and placing it in the hands of OTHERS. I'm not saying that certain support or "trades" are neccessarily bad (such as swaping online banners between your site and another individual's website); however, to delibrately alter parts of your film for even 'potential' sponsorship (such as changing a character's clothing to those created by a clothing manufacturer, like you discribed), you have given up creative control of your film - your VISION - to other individuals who may or (more likely) may not understand a single thing about independent Film/Animation.
Yes, this is exacly what the Major Studios do all the time and yes, they have become very successful and influential by using advertising/branding to gain prominance. However, they (or more specifically, the filmmakers of those Studios) have also lost something as a result: total creative control of their work, given instead to corporations that are only interested in selling their products. (btw, PBS did a fantastic documentary called "The Persuaders" which discusses this and other aspects of advertising, marketing, and branding of corporations)
For independent filmmakers the last thing you want to do is lose creative control of your work, because after that happens... it's not longer your work.
I think Jason intended to reply to Shawn's post here...
Tyler: Some of those books sound really good. I may have to check them out myself.
I'm wondering about all the same stuff you guys are... Actually I just did this interview wherein I talk about this kind stuff, you can watch the video here...
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2236075155264874866&hl=en
I'm going with a DVD through a non exclusive DVD distributor... an "ipod" res download through another service and an full 1080p res download through another service... If you've created some buzz around your film you can sell Pre-orders of the DVD...then you can use that money to actually replicate the DVD's and the like... Here's a really informative video about the DVD market...
http://cinematech.blogspot.com/2007/06/advice-for-indie-filmmakers-peter.html
uhh... yeah, I meant shawn and not tyler.
God, my brain is totally fried today :P
mdotstrange: These interviews are awesome! I remember Scott Kirsner wrote a comment on this blog somewhere.
There is some very good information in the interviews posted by strange, so if anyone hasn't watched them yet, I recommend you check them out. I think the idea of using multiple methods is a good one, and I also think the idea of making that connection with the audience from your own site is equally necessary. For us, building that audience is crucial. It's not about one big film, but buiding a core audience that is with you for the long haul, over the course of many projects, or even a series.
Another point which was not mentioned, and applies more to branding than to a single film is that you gotta give. They say that "the more you give away, the more sales you get." People love free stuff! Build your audience by giving! Funimation made one of the smartest moves I have seen in putting out that sampler disc, that came with one episode, each, of Basilisk, Trinity Blood, Speedgrapher and Desert Punk, free for the taking at comic stores, book stores and video stores everywhere. Guys at work who don't even watch anime had them. How many new people did they gain with that one?! Giving is great marketing.
Hey Tyler,
I don't see it as giving up freedom.
I mentioned finding companies that fit your film.
In the case of the T-shirt wearing character and a scene where the character is dressed up in that type apparel, it actually works in the film. It is a gag that I felt had to be in the the film and thought of them when I did it. Then I thought to ask the guys from that sight (which I haven't done just yet) if I could have this in my movie.
Okay just to let you know and remember I haven't approached Lonestarrunner just yet on it and I'm not until I have more to show but there is a scene in my movie where Flog dresses up as a wrestler/luchador. He dresses up like Strongbad. I'm a fan of Strongbad and wanted this scene in my film as an homage. At the same time it may be appreciated by these guys and they may show it off their website. It's just an idea.
The other thing was sponsorhip that fits your product. As an indie you have more options.
One of the scenes in the film has one of the characters selling Mexican candies and gum to folks.
There is a certain brand that is very popular and I eat myself. I buy it at Mexican candy stores and if you have gone to Mexico you'd see the kids selling a certain type of gum. These scenes are in the movie, so instead of just depicting a box that looks like them I descided to ask the company that makes it if they'd like to sponsor it and I include them in the film.
It was already a part of the film, but instead of the generic box that looked like that brand, I have the actual brand.
The thing is I'm not just letting any John Giant Company get in on the film but specific things that are already in the film.
Why does the computer on the desk in my movie have to be generic when I can get "Dell" "HP" "APPLE" to pay me a check to put a Dell, HP or Apple computer on the desk. Heck I"m working on a Dell in real life as we speak. Why can't my character in the movie use a Dell. People see my Dell all the time and say "What kind of Dell you have?"
I believe strongly in selective sponsorship. Characters in your movie have to use props why not make it a name brand if you can and get a real life check.
Personally for me I enjoy the commercial part as much as telling stories and animating.
It's a personal thing. I enjoy being creative in ways to make a profit off of my hard work and hopefully have the ability to make a living someday doing what I love to do without working a day job that I don't like.
The farmer has to look back and admire his great work and the sell the corn, cotton, watermelon, etc to be able to plant next year.
I hope one day to be like Osamu Tezuka and create all the stories I want to tell and make that my living.
I don't think it makes you lose creative freedom. In fact its a means to obtain my financial freedom in order to use my creativity to make a living.
If you go to CGtalk you'll find hundreds of great artists who love to model, animate and tell stories of their own, but they stay stuck in the studio making other people's movies and stories. Half of them because they don't know the business side of things. They can make a great short for their school thesis, but in the real world end up a cog in the wheel because they don't know business.
So I think it's my joy in being creative on the business side of things that rocks.
It reminds me of the days when I loved telling stories as a child. I would make custom stories but the stories I wanted to tell and then sell them for a quarter in a construction paper book :)
I love both sides creating the movie and creating the business. Both allow me the creative feeling and the power to release myself from the day job!
MDotStrange,
I hope you start distributing soon dude! I want that freakin movie!
So my creative freedom is not gone. I plan on creating that freedom to a greater extent.
Aside from in-film product placement, I pretty much agree with everything Shawn said about promoting one's film. I think trading advertising is a good idea; most feature films have trailers/commercials in front of them, so it shouldn't seem out of place in front of an indie film either (as long as the viewer can skip the ads or fast forward through them.) I also agree that it is important to build a community among your fan base. I'm here at Studio Art FX every day to see what Terrence and the rest of you have to say. I stop by kazeghostwarrior.com to see if Timothy Albee has anything to say (alas, Timothy's site has become a missed opportunity for community development.) As a result, as soon as Terrence has a new video to sell, I'll be one of the customers that he will reach through his community website.
I plan to market myself through the Artist Alleys at various anime/comic conventions, even though my film (should I ever start and finish it) won't be anime style per-se.
On the DVD vs Download issue, I'm still convinced that a DVD is the only way to really make money at it. Maybe that's because I own DVDs for Anime: Concept to Reality, Kaze Ghost Warrior, Voices from a Distant Star, The Place Promised in our Early Years, Kaena, and other small/indie animated films. On the other hand, I've never paid to download any video online. I like having the movie on my shelf where I can go back to it any time I like, rather than have to keep it on my hard drive (which is always filling up), or archived off onto some CD-R somewhere that looks like all my other archived CD-Rs. Besides, if you are printing up say 1000 to 3000 of the DVDs per run, you ought to be able to keep the cost of production down to $1.30 each (http://www.diskmakers.com/film). Even with shipping, your overhead is probably only $4 per unit for materials (and usually the customer will pay for shipping anyways). That's not a lot of overhead, and your customer will feel like they actually received something tangible for their money.
The internet is there for marketing, community, information, trailers, emails to your previous customers, and just overall going out, finding your potential customers, and letting them know about your product. It can be for distribution too, but it doesn't have to be. It is the ability to reach your customers that makes the internet level the playing field between us indies and the big studios. Delivery of the product is cheap both for online delivery as well as printing up DVDs and shipping them out to customers.
Cheers,
Michael Duffy
shawn: Maybe you and I just have different perspectives on this issue, which is perfectly fine. However, there was one sentence which utterly confounded me:
"Why does the computer on the desk in my movie have to be generic when I can get "Dell" "HP" "APPLE" to pay me a check to put a Dell, HP or Apple computer on the desk. Heck I"m working on a Dell in real life as we speak. Why can't my character in the movie use a Dell. People see my Dell all the time and say "What kind of Dell you have?'"
The reason why you shouldn't do that is simple: Dell is not a type of personal computer - it is a corportation and the name of their brand. Unless you have specific 'written' permission from the company that you can use their product in your work, it is ILLEGAL for you to use their brand within your film (no 'ifs', 'ands', or 'buts').
Also, you are opperating under the ASSUMPTION that because your product will be successful, a company like Dell will 'understand' your use of their brand and be willing to pay you for showcasing it in your film. That is sheer IGNORANCE: regardless of how successful your product is, the fact would be that you used Dell's brand WITHOUT their consent and they could then take legal acton against you (aka, sue you back into the stone age).
Perhaps I'm just IP paranoid, but when I was studying to be a graphic designer, the biggest area that my instructors drilled into my head was Copywrite and Intellectual Property rights and how simply ASSUMING something would be alright to use (without taking the time to get specific permission/consent) can lead you in a world of trouble.
Shawn I believe you were talking to Jason, not me. I don't have any problem with product placement, nor do I think creativity is some kind of holy thing that everything else must work around. On my second student film (which didn't turn out very well because of equipment problems and people getting sick), I went to a local coffee house called "Iowa Cafe." The owner asked me to put the "Iowa Cafe" sign in there, and I didn't have any problem with that. So we had the murder scene right there by the Iowa Cafe sign :). It also didn't hurt that the owner like the story I wrote, but you get the idea. I got one of the cafe employees to act in it, and he made lunch for everybody, and even cleaned up the fake blood off the sidewalk afterwards. Oh, I'll be glad not to have to deal with fake blood on the sidewalk any more...
M Dot: Swedish multi-plex media streaming? WOW! I want that...where can we get that? (just kidding). You know, they used to just go around from one town to the next and put up tents. That's roughing it, but that's what they did.
Forgot to add another important point in my last post:
"Why does the computer on the desk in my movie have to be generic when I can get "Dell" "HP" "APPLE" to pay me a check to put a Dell, HP or Apple computer on the desk."
If anything, Dell/Apple/etc would have you PAY THEM because you would be using their copywrite/brand in your product.
To Michael:
I think the competition out there is going to be stiff. Netflix just started offering a five dollar a month membership. For that you get
two DVD rentals per month, plus three you watch on your computer. Five movies, even new dvd releases, for a buck a piece. It's happening, and the big guys can already do it cheaper. So I guess what Terrence said about branding is important.
Jason,
Sorry for the misunderstanding. I should have put other information to be more clear.
In other words if you are creating a movie with a prop in the movie such as a computer then what harm is it if you put a "Dell" on the desk.
I'm talking about generating revenue for your movie. In other words approach those companies if possible and tell them about your movie and if they want an in ad product placement in the movie and they can pay you. If you don't get that deal I'm not going through the trouble of modeling a 3d Dell computer for the desk.
In other words I was talking about specific product placement. INstead of generic props use name brand props people use everyday.
Like that cartoon I'm making where the kids are selling candy. I wanted it in my movie to be a specific brand so I'm approaching the company to see if they'd like to sponsor it or if there is a way they can support my film in any way.
In other words you have to do the business side and get that legalized.
I'm not talking about randomly putting name brand products in your film and hope when they see it they like it and then they pay you.
I'm talking about targetting certain groups you'd like to work with or have some relevance and ask them if they want a product placement in their movie A) because it fits well within the movie B) Would they like to offer some financial or other support for the film that may include their product.
I'm talking contracts and the like.
It's subtle ways of generating revenue, staying independent and having the funds to really make your film the way you want to and creating the time to do it because now you do it for a living.
There are many routes to take for people. Some fish their idea around Hollywood but don't get results and if they do they lose creative freedom.
The other way is to go the poor boy way and do everything yourself. Which is highly possible and has been proven to work and is long and hard and sometimes lonely.
The other way is to get some backing somewhere from some person who is interested in sponsoring you. They allow you the freedom and like the advetisement and hte fun of the product.
Terrence has in fact showcased or mentioned two of such projects.
Ramen Noodles with that anime race cell shaded movie.
and
Budweiser is sponsoring After World I believe is the name.
IN the Anime Race Cell Shaded movie you see some characters eating Ramen noodles. It fits the film and allows them an amount of freedom and plus they get financial backing.
That is what I'm talking about. So if I can get Dell to sponsor my movie, I keep my rights and all I have to do is say I made this movie on a Dell and have a Dell on the computer Desk of the main characters computer desk then that is okay by me.
Really though to each their own. I am just glad to see everyone working in their own way toward the indie animation film. It only helps further our cause. Their is power in numbers. :) And I'll definately buy any of your DVDs from anyone that is on this sight :)
Terrence: Perhaps I was a bit grandiose. I meant more with being inline with making your content available to a larger audience. I think you hit my point on the head with the Afterworld idea. My question should have been, how to go from the 1000 hits to 10,000 then 100,000? What and where to place your ads, blogs, etc. to affectively get 'in front' of more eyes and potentially have more purchases. In affect, how do you go about getting on the 'front page'? I think it has to be through contacts, networking and persistance. When I got the first episode done, it was hundreds of hits. With the second it was thousands of hits, and hopefully with the third, thousands more. I feel it all has to be branding or genre or something that is 'your niche' that comes to mind when people think of your creations or products that will keep them coming back if they like what you are doing. I, also, feel it has to be you in your creations. You have to enjoy it, feel passionate about it and have fun with it. If, as an indie, you are always trying to create to 'make it big'; then, you are always looking for the money as the pay off and not necessarily the enjoyment of creation.
Hey Terrence based on the many excellent responses here don't you think it's time for a forum?
ernest: You got it exactly right. First hundreds, then thousands, then 100,000, by your persistence and continuing. Let it build. I definitely think genere matters. Too many indies create projects which may be gret and have all the production values in the world, but they have no point of attraction. You know the kind, where they create some "important" drama or story about their home town that has little chance of drawing an audience without Tom Cruise in it. Sci-Fi, fantasy, horror, action, zombies, monsters, even anime, these things have their own audiences already and it helps a lot to make use of them.
I read somewhere that Buddha said, "Work out your own salvation. Do not depend on others." While there is nothing wrong with getting that front page nod on Youtube, it is totally out of your control. What you can do though is any video you put on Youtube or Metacafe, you can embed that video in your own site with the code they give you. The views still tally at the main site, raising the popularity of your video or gaining you money on Metacafe. Bring the people to your site. If you have contacts with bloggers, like me, get them to embed a teaser video in a blog post.
The greatest thing you can do, though, in my view, is offer free stuff that people will talk about. You want things people feel they have to tell their friends about that attract more people to the site. You could write articles, or make extra features type materials that are free on the site.
There's so much info available on the possibilities that have developed just this year I think it's time for some Beyond Concept to Reality videos that put a good focus on marketing as well as the new methods of production.
knighton: Yes. I have been thinking that throughout this discussion! I need to figure out one thing thouugh and that is how to keep the bots out.
Apparently, the kaptcha thing is no longer as effective as it once was because the spammers will have a real person sign up the account and then turn it over to the bot. I may have to manually approve sign ups, or find out another way to keep SPAM out. I think it is Anime Nation or something that asks to see your site and samples of your work before they let you on. I forgot which forum that was.
I think a forum here is a must, just like I think it is high time for some next generation "Concept to Reality" videos. I will try to get something going in the next week or so.
Shawn: ok, now I get your line of thinking. As for myself, targeting companies for potential finiance/revenue through the use of product placement would not be something I'd be interested in doing; for me personally, to do such a thing I'd feel would take away my creative freedom as an independent (in additon, that process would not work very well for the types of stories I'm creating). If it works well for you and projects and still allows you to keep your own creative freedom, though, then by all means do it.
M Dot: those are some excellent, informative interviews you posted. I definately agree that the more traditional distribution methods are still currently 'locked out' from independent filmmakers; I'm especially struck by the 'limitations' of Independents trying to do 35mm theatrical releases for their films.
It reminds me of a odd thought I had with watching the DVD release of Phil Nibbelink's animated film, "Romeo and Juliet: Sealed with a Kiss" - in the Making-Of featurette, it was stated that Nibbelink 'filmed' the digital animated frames (all art/animation he did for the film was created on the computer) onto 35mm film stock, from which he synced with the film's audio/sound track and created the final version of the film (which I assume was then transfered back into digital for the DVD release). My perspective is that whole process which he used is that it's increbible convoluted, costly, and ultimately unneccessary for a digital independent filmmaker. If so much of the film is digital, why not just do the entire process digitally? Why not just create the entire film digitally and THEN transfer the final film onto 35mm film (for theatrical release)?
Jasonn: Quality! Although there are a few services out there like DVfilm.com that will transfer a Quicktime file, an HD Cam tape or other media to 35mm for you, for best results there is still no higher quality method than to use a laser film recorder to transfer the original high res frames to film. Transferring individual high res frames would still give you higher quality than what you see when you view an all digital film like 300 or Star Wars: Epsiode III transferred from HD.
I am curious, though. Is the DVD widescreen only or is there a full screen version too? I would suspect that, in the same vein as Pixar, he actually did the film at a 4:3 aspect and cropped it for theatrical, thus allowing an easy transfer to full screen for DVD, as most children's products continue to do. You can't really do that in HD which is only widescreen.
Terrence: ah... that does make sense, I suppose. However, I would still imagine that that process of laser film recording would be fairly expensive (more than what most indies have in their budget to afford).
In regards to the aspect ratio, Nibbelink used a 1.33.1 aspect ratio for "Romeo and Juliet" and that's what is used for the DVD release - there is no widescreen version available. In the featurette, they did show video scense of what looked like a 'widescreen' version of the film, but I think perhaps Nibbelink did a 16:9 'crop' of the film for it's theatrical distribution (kinda like what some studios did with animated childrens films in the 80s, like "Transformers" or "Rainbow Brite").
Also, I was under the belief that Pixar always created widescreen versions of their films first, which they then used to create the 'pan and scan' version (as well as rendering additional on-screen elements to better take advantage of the 4:3 aspect ratio).
I think the more avenues you have through which your work is made available,the better. I will surely go for both. It is a fact that some people would never give up the physical Disc. I remember downloading the entire album of Enya from Napster at $.99.00 a pop. I wasn't satisfied because I still want to hold the album in m y hands and feel it, see it look at it among my other collections.
In adopting the two methods, you serve the people who are tilted towards the digital files and those like me who'd rather have the darn thing on the palm of their hands.
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